The day I realized there are flaws in Breaking Dawn Part 2

Update: Stephenie Addressed the BD Part 2 Ending on her blog (coincidence, huh?)

While we’ve only spent time gushing over BD part 2 because we thought it was a pretty darn perfect end to a pretty darn perfect saga (I mean…. except for all the things we’ve complained about over the past 4 years…) we have to share a recent letter we got because she’s NOT the only one who noticed this imperfection. This is hard though… I mean complaining about Twilight after all the #RIPTwilight we’ve gone through? Isn’t that like bad-mouthing grandpa soon after his funeral? Oh well, forgive us Grandpa (aka Stephenie & Bill & Buttcrack Santa) Also this contains SPOILERS which at this point if the ending hasn’t been spoiled for you, you must have a much fuller life than I….

Dear Twilight Saga: Breaking Dawn Part 2,

So I’ve started thinking about other aspects of the movie, now that I’m starting to relax and breathe again after that shock of the sight of Carlisle beheaded (oh, right, SPOILER ALERT…. how long until you don’t need to say that any longer? A week? A month? Until it’s out of theaters?).

Breaking Dawn battle scene

SPOILER ALERT: This happens

Anyway, earlier today something dawned on me (albeit, I’m a little disappointed in myself for not realizing this sooner, but, you know, Carlisle, Seth, Jasper DEAD… yeah, that’s a lot to get past) and I’ve decided that we need to sit down and have a chat about Alice. Specifically her visions.

But first, let me get something straight; Alice can’t see werewolves… right? And… Alice can’t see Nessie… correct? And this is true, not just in the books, but in the movies, right?

Yeah. I thought so.

So, why do I ask? Well, I was wondering how is it that Alice would see things about Jacob and Renesmee. Like the fact that they would need passports?

Okay, okay, that one I can see you talking your way out of that it was just a precaution, that she didn’t know, but knew that she had to give the best possible chance of Nessie surviving even if the rest of them were doomed and it was just a slim chance, she was still going to take it. Fine.

alice-jasper

“Are you turned on?” “Yeah… I can see the wolves now…!”

But then, tell me, how did Alice see Jacob and Nessie running away and Jacob slaughtering that vamp chasing them without slowing down his full-on sprint if she can’t see either of them? Because that was part of her vision Aro saw. Or if you’re going to argue that we (the audience) wouldn’t have believed that they would have been able to flee un-chased, or that it made for good dramatic effect and suspense (and then relief knowing they got away safely). Fine.

But how did Alice see the whole fight to Aro’s death if the wolves were there? Didn’t the wolves involvement with the fight in Eclipse against the newborns cause her to go blind? Wouldn’t that mean that Alice wouldn’t have been able to see anything about the standoff with the Volturi the moment that the wolves were involved? Or did Alice work on her ability to see around her blind spots and get really good at it. But then, how did she see Seth dying? Or Leah?

Or was there something that happened when Nessie was born that no longer blinded Alice? Or maybe the weremagic of Jacob imprinting on Renesmee unclouded her vision of both werewolves and half-vamps? Hallelujah! Alice is cured! The link was made between wolf human and vamp and now she could see them all. Maybe it was supposed to have made the movie, but was cut out during editing and was therefore never explained to us that in the movie version, Alice can now see those half-breeds.

That has to be it, because how else could Alice have seen that vision of Edward, Bella, Jacob and Renesmee all together after little Nessie is “all growed up”, assuring Edward know that his whole family would have a happily ever after?

Oh, I’m not complaining. I still think the twist was pure genius and wouldn’t have you change it, nor would I take back the blissfully happy vision Alice has at the end of the film of the 4 of them, the picture of a perfect, happy family.

I’m simply curious.

Mind still blown from BDII,
TeamJacobEdward

Hmmm….. since I’m the world’s worst Twilight fan, did Stephenie ever address how Alice knew Nessie & Jake would need passports in the book? Do we know HOW Alice can suddenly see things where the wolves are involved? Or is this just the magic of Hollywood (and prayers from Stephenie that we all forget about that teeny tiny detail from the books?)

Do you care? Does it matter to you?

PS: In case you wonder what I think… I don’t care. I want to be entertained by a story I love and characters I love. And I was!)

PPS: Around the Thanksgiving table when we were asked what we were thankful for, #1 I said Mr. Choice for putting up with me & vampires for 4 years. #2 I said Moon because she’s the world’s best Moon and #3 I said you. Yes you. I told my Grandpa and everything…. xo UC

Our internet game is ridiculous: LTR, The Forum, Twitter, The Store
  • Isa

    I seen that too but I Decided I didn’t want to mention it or think about it sense it is the last movie of the twilight saga

    • TeamJacobEdward

      Yes. But it wouldn’t be LTT if we didn’t say anything. #RIPTwiligh or not. It’s what we do. We bring IP things like bad wigs, little bottles, jorts, jumping Robs and everything else. It’s why I love LTT. We do this not to hate but because we love

      • MariaCecilia

        And we bring up sparklepeens and the important questions of whether unchanging vampires have PERMANENT erections? Or can cut their hair. (Maybe they just buy new wigs?)

        • MarbleNutSlut

          Also, Mr. Slut asked me why Edward couldn’t hear Bella’s thoughts when she shielded him during “Jedi Training”…I was like, “err. maybe she wasn’t thinking anything? Or it’s just a Plot Hole?!”

          • TeamSeth

            Oh, that’s in the book. It’s because the shield doesn’t leave her head and go out over everyone, it stays on her head and then spreads from there. So she can’t actually share her brain with anyone unless she lifts the shield from her head entirely (which is different than spreading it). It’s like 2 shields. You know how sometimes a little bubble gets stuck on a bigger bubble? It’s nothing like that, but if it helps, think about it like that. ;)

          • Sisterpenguin

            Maybe a balloon when you punch into it, or for those anatomy weirdos *waves* your pleura around your lungs

          • TeamJacobEdward

            Exactly. :) Or like a smoke ring… a cloud of smoke that can expand to others until you push the center away and you have a smoke ring. Hmmm. Never mind. I like your bubble reference better

          • MariaCecilia

            I imagine Bella and her shield-work is just how it feels when I wiggle my ears and widen my pupils:it’s about finding the tiny muscles by visualizing them – will over matter!

          • http://www.talksupe.wordpress.com snowwhitedrifted

            Sadly, this reminds me of a conversation I heard on the radio today about a mole/ wart growing it’s own mole/ wart.

          • TeamJacobEdward

            Because shielding him along with her is different than pushing her shield away from her self. It’s a skill beyond just shielding another… like another layer.
            Yes, I know/remember this from the book. She practiced with Zafrina.

        • TeamJacobEdward

          Exactly

        • TeamJacobEdward

          Sparklepeens!! :D
          or if they’re not Permarections, and they work w/ bloodflow like humans, if the vamp hasn’t fed recently, does that mean the guy has an issue w/ that?

          • MariaCecilia

            Which is why Edward didn’t jump Bella in New Moon the moment he realized she was ALIIIVE – he really, really wanted to, but he just couldn’t make it. ;)

          • TeamJacobEdward

            Poor Edward. He was cursing himself for being so morose he refused to even feed in months.

          • TeamSeth

            You’d think he’d take some liquids in Brazil…. BUT NO. #emovampiresarelame

        • Sisterpenguin

          I’ve thought the sparklepeen through:
          Unfortunately no permanent erections (would spoil the line of those designer trousers) because (in my tiny brain) all the bodies’ cells have crystalised, with the venom as interstitial fluid and running through the cardio vascular system. The heart doesn’t pump but the crystalised muscles still work so the little muscles you have in the arterial walls pump the fluids through, into the sparklepeen, and since there’s no aerobic or anaerobic cellular activity going on, no muscle fatigue.
          In short, it goes up and stays up as long as they want.

          I think I may have thought about this a little too much

          • MarbleNutSlut

            you have thought about this exactly the right amount. #enabler

          • The Old One

            Nobel Prize for Vampire Science goes to SisterPenguin!

          • MariaCecilia

            I’m so glad someone thought about it long enough to explain it to me! And that there are Twilight fans with medical educations…

          • itshowtimenikki

            i love the amount of thought that went into this! #thatsnormal

      • itshowtimenikki

        THIS!!!! THIIIIISSS!!

  • Ellie

    Pretty sure Stephanie broke her own cannon. Also, I think that in the books Alice sent Bella in search of passports as a last resort if they were unable to come up with another solution. I would have less of an issue with Alice suddenly being able to see Nessie and the wolves if it was not such a big part of New Moon and Eclipse.

    • TeamJacobEdward

      Yes. But in the book, she didn’t decide on passports. In the book she just led Bella to J. Jenks. It was Bella who determined there wasn’t hope for her and Edward, but she was going to try to ensure there was hope for her daughter.

    • TeamSeth

      And such a big part of BD1! I mean, if she could see Nessie then 1) she’d know it’s a girl 2) healthy 3) Bella would live as a vamp and how it would go down 4) the morphine wouldn’t help bella 5) Jacob imprints! 6) Wolf fight isn’t gonna happen, so don’t bring it up again.

      I mean, BD1 would’ve been super yawnfest if Alice could see Nessie and the wolves. Seriously, it’d be like “Let’s just honeymoon the whole damn time, cuz there is not going to be any plot tension.”

      • MarbleNutSlut

        Wolf fight is over, Alice! Don’t bring it up again!

        aww. now I am FanCamp sad again…

      • TeamJacobEdward

        [Enter weremagic upon imprintation]

        (yeah, imprintation isn’t a word. I know)

        • TeamSeth

          Right, because we’re worried about that… werewolves aren’t real. Imprintation is legit!

          • TeamJacobEdward

            Werewolves aren’t real?!?
            Say it ain’t so!

          • Teamseth

            Out loud?

    • Scruffy Taylor

      In BD2 movie, it was Jasper who was mentioned as ordering the passports for Bellar. I assume so that Alice wouldn’t give it away in her thoughts to Aro?!

  • lonedroid

    I don’t know about you guys but I’ve decided that Alice has long been
    trolling the Cullen family and wasn’t honest about her abilities because
    she never actually liked Bella for Edward. She knew Bella was nothing
    but trouble and only decided to reveal her ability to see werewolves
    when she realized Jasper’s life would be compromised.

    • TeamSeth

      This is the most logical thought. Wasn’t Alice in an insane asylum before she was turned…?

      • TeamJacobEdward

        Of course! HA!

      • Sisterpenguin

        *sigh* Young lady. She was in an insane asylum BECAUSE she was having visions of the future.

        It’s normal to know this shit isn’t it?

        • MarbleNutSlut

          yes, I knew that. Like Edward was saying, your vampiric gifts are typically an enhancement of what you have as a human. Jasper was able to influence people, Edward was intuitive though not psychic, Bella clearly already had super self control, otherwise she would have tried WAY harder to get to that sparklepeen as a human. I know I would have.

          • Sisterpenguin

            Yeah, Bella was just weird

          • MariaCecilia

            Dude is weird…

          • TeamSeth

            WeirdoG!

          • TeamJacobEdward

            HA! No doubt about it! The rest of the human race would have been ALL over that.

        • TeamJacobEdward

          Totally Normal.
          And you’re right. But conspiracy theory is un to entertain… ;)

    • itshowtimenikki

      lonedroid wins the day. alice has been trolling everyone since forever.

    • TeamSeth

      Also, why is Alice forcing Bella into chiffon when she’s wearing
      cotton in that photo above (with jasper’s wallet chain — FUR REALZ?) ?

      Clearly Alice hates Bella.

  • Laxplays

    Nope, doesn’t matter! Such a great ending, it actually hid the fact, that the film was quite slow up until that fight scene! That fight scene caught you unawares, and you completely forgot, that prior to that, it was dragging a little! Don’t get me wrong though, I floved the film and the new vamps were entertaining and a breath of fresh air!

    And I will never forget the audience reaction, at the LA prem, to that darn fight scene……..it was hysterical!

    x

    • Laxplays

      and how many times can I say *fight scene* in one, kinda sorta looking paragraph?!!!

      • MariaCecilia

        Say it. Out loud.

        • TeamSeth

          FIGHT SCENE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

          • MariaCecilia

            Thank you!

    • http://twitter.com/17_4awhile 17_4awhile

      One of my friends asked me this question the other day. I think the answer is that Alice is showing Aro the future through his thoughts, and Aro can THINK about the wolves, and Renesmee, all he wants. He’s met her and the wolves at this point (Heeeheeeheheeeeeeeee! Renesmee!!! –> best part of movie, hands down) so they are not unknown to him. Does this make any sense? I took it as not Alice’s vision of the future, but Alice’s vision of Aro’s decision and what Aro saw as a result of that decision, as it all “played out”. the last thing we see is Aro seeing the fire coming towards his face as Bella’s about the burn his sorry ass, then cut to Alice. this to me tells us that Alice is showing Aro’s future thoughts/memories if he made the choice to fight, not a vision of her future thoughts/memories. Um, yeah. Purple’s cool.

      • TeamSeth

        “(Heeeheeeheheeeeeeeee! Renesmee!!! –> best part of movie, hands down)”

        I love you.

        This makes sense, but then not. Because Alice can only see the results of people’s choices… except wolves and vampire human mutations.

    • JellyBeanRainbow

      It was dragging a little. I almost fell asleep, twice. Until the fight scene.

  • Lisamarie

    Well, in the book Alice said “I couldn’t even be sure that someone like Nahuel existed—all I knew was that I would be looking for something I couldn’t see! Try to imagine searching for a blind spot—not the easiest thing I’ve ever done.” So I’m thinking they changed/ignored that in order to give us heart failure.

    • http://letterstotwilight.com UnintendedChoice

      please tell me you memorized that?

      • Lisamarie

        I remember her saying it and where it was in the books. But I looked so I wouldn’t miss quote. And I get weird looks from my family all the time for knowing these things lol.

    • itshowtimenikki

      it’s totally normal to know this stuff. duh.

  • MariaCecilia

    That werewolf hallaballoo has always been the wrench in the machinery, because Stephenie just couldn’t stick with the idea to its logical end. Plus how could Alice come back and touch Aro without giving away that she ordered passports for Reneesme and Jacob? I just don’t get it..Hey, but then Skyfall didn’t make sense either, so I guess it’s not a werewolf thing, it’s a movie thing. PS. We don’t celebrate Thanksgiving, but I give up a prayer of thanks for LTT more often than once a year anyway…just saying.

    • http://letterstotwilight.com UnintendedChoice

      yay!

  • Sisterpenguin

    Yup. Noticed it too but enjoyed the film so much (especially with the LA audience – scream it out babies!!!) that overlooked it.

    As folks have said, in the books Alice can’t see the futures of the wolves because of their changeable and impulsive natures and Renesmee because of her mixed nature (see LisaMarie’s comment).

    Even VampBella has been dumbed down by having decisions taken away from her – she twigged the page from the book thing immediately and was reasonably clever about working out who J Jenks was and what she’d need from him.

    But I don’t care. It took me to LA where I got to meet fantastic people (and some crazies – yikes!).
    It takes me away from RL (what a relief) for two hours. That’s worth soooo much.

    • TeamSeth

      I do care, damnit! Bella was the bloody star of BD2 and totes awesome and made it WORTH sitting through ALL her annoying uncertanity and insecruity for 3.5 effing books, and THEY TOOK IT AWAY FROM HER!!!!!!!! Just let her shield be the thing that rocks it hard. That protects Garret from Kate. That saves the freaking day. Let her be awesome, all on her own. This is NOT Harry Potter where Dumbledore shoves “FRIENDS ARE AWESOME” down our throats for 5 movies. NO. This is Twilight. Please let Bella have her moment. Who is writing these things? She’s not allowed to cook in one movie cuz it’s too “barefoot in the kitchen”, but she can’t make any impact on the world in another movie because someone else breaks all cannon to convince a male he will die so he leaves? Who is writing this and why can’t she be effing consistent in her weird choice of feminism plot changes?!!!

      (stomps and pouts)

      I mean, yeah, I loved BD2. Best of all the films. Well, except the score. Still prefer NM score. Does anyone else feel like we could have skipped NM and Eclipse and just had Twilight and Breaking Dawns? The story would’ve basically made sense still, I think. I mean, add a scene in BD1 where it’s shown/explained that Jacob is a shapeshifter wolf and then we’re all good.

      :)

      • MarbleNutSlut

        This. This is why M. Rosenberg is the Worst. Feminist. Ever.

      • TeamJacobEdward

        I missed the shapeshifter mention/explanation too

        • TeamSeth

          i didn’t. Edward was such a dickwad in that scene. I wanted to furplode his face.

          “Oh, Bella, you just saved us all? Well guess what, you’re still an idiot!” SMACK! Ugh.

          • TeamJacobEdward

            Hmmmm, I don’t remember that scene quite the same way as you did…. I’ll have to crack open my BD book tonight when I get home to check that out.
            #fursplodelove
            #jortsforever
            #knickerbockermemories

          • TeamSeth

            *sniff sniff* I found Knickbocker on the map.

          • Sisterpenguin

            Knickerbocker glory?

          • TeamJacobEdward

            Wait… was it the whole: shrug “It didn’t seem necessary to mention”
            thing?
            Yeah, I kind of get your point on that.

          • TeamSeth

            it was. it was his “I’ve been withholding information from you because you’re too weak and feeble to handle that shit. Because I’m so fucking awesome because I’m bloody Edward. See me sour puss roar, bitch.”

            You know, just like that.

      • The Old One

        It’s funny you feel we could skip NM and Eclipse–because wasn’t Stephenie’s original story (Forever Dawn) basically Twilight and Breaking Dawn? I have to go and look at her website again. Then the publisher wanted more books, so she came up with all that filler. Personally I can see New Moon being more or less a good plot device, but Eclipse to me is total filler, and don’t even get me started on that Bree thing.

        • MariaCecilia

          Actually, I sort of liked BD least because of all the shockers (vampire Caesarian, imprinting on babies) and liked Eclipse best because it developed the relationship between Bella and Edward after the car crash that was New Moon. *sigh* Guess that’s just me. (Liked Carter Burwell’s Twilight score best, too.)

      • MariaCecilia

        Your stomping and pouting should be made into a trailer that they show before the actual film…

    • MarbleNutSlut

      YES. Scream it out!

  • beaarthur

    I think it was Aro’s vision not Alice, she is just the vessel. Stop picking it all apart and enjoy it.

    • Sisterpenguin

      Watch the film – Aro doesn’t have visions, he sees the thoughts of others when he touches them.

      SPOILER ALERT: Picking apart (in a loving way) is what happens here… Enjoy it

      • TeamJacobEdward

        Thank you. Yes. It’d out of love.

      • TeamJacobEdward

        And yes, Aro is visionless books and movies. Which is why he covets Alice so much, it’s not just lustinesd (which we all KNOW he wants her that way too, because, dude, creepy). But he covets Alice for her ability to see the future and now Bella for her ability to shield (his comment at the end of the movie about “such a prize” tells you he wants to acquire them and totally opens the possibility for another movie… js).

    • TeamSeth

      Why would Aro envision himself and all his people dying? Also, Aro had no way to know that there were even werewolves, let alone so many. Irene didn’t tell him that little detail, not even in the book I don’t think. And Alice isn’t a vessel for seeing other people’s visions, but for seeing the outcome(s) of other people’s decisions. She can however CHOOSE which outcome she wants to portray to Aro, because he can only read minds and she’s able to block out parts of her mind from Edward, so she could do the same to Aro, too. So it’s possible she had like 5 billion different versions of how shit went down on the baseball clearing / battlefield and chose only the one in which Aro dies as the one to show him.

      • TeamJacobEdward

        But Aro can read every thought you’ve ever had. I don’t think you can block things from Aro…

        • TeamSeth

          Hm, that’s true. Hmmmmmmm new can of worms.

          • TeamJacobEdward

            Like certain flaws with BD the book? Yep, I know.

        • Sisterpenguin

          Aro – touching people since 1280BC…

          • MariaCecilia

            Aro – makes people’s thoughts talk…

          • TeamSeth

            HOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

      • The Old One

        Aro would have seen the werewolves from Edward when he touched him in New Moon, from Edward’s memories of the first time they ran into them and made the treaty, and then from Alice when she goes back after seeing Bella jumping off the cliff, and she knows Jacob has transformed. Irina–well, that’s another plot hole–why she is pissed off about the wolves killing off Laurent. She shouldn’t have known that little fact, but she does, so that’s in her mind when she goes to tattle on the Cullens.

        • Teamseth

          You’re so right!

          Irina does know the fact though cuz of the familial like relationship between the two clans (denali and cullen). I think. /shrug BD book plot hole.

          Why she let Laurent go is the bigger question. #hotFrenchman

          • The Old One

            Very hot!

  • http://twitter.com/AthiraAlice AthiraTheFullmoon

    Hey, Its not like that. Alice knew the Voltury was coming (Her vision); the reason behind this, well, anyone can guess its because of Renesmee. So Alice simply ‘thought’ about the Pass port plan, and while Jake is imprinted and all, he also will accompany Nessie! See, there is no confusion! Stephenie is not mistaken!!!

  • BeaDee

    Sigh. Yes, all true. But the book straight up would have made a movie that my unicorn-in-denial disliked just as much as the previous ones. Add in a battle sequence and he wants “to see the battle 8 more times to catch it all.” Canon would have granted me more Charlie watching football while Emmett makes innuendos time, and maybe an extended version of those bonfire war stories and Bella would have been fully empowered… but it would have been a little anti-climactic. And that’s the ultimate movie no-no.

    • TeamSeth

      Puhleeze. Did you see Prometheus?!

      And technically, the movie WAS anticlimactic. It just had a ginormous fight scene that never occurred… But it made Anne of Green Gables frolic WORTH IT.

      • TeamSeth

        omg! I just realized. This whole fight scene in BD2 being non-cannon was so that we would KNOW that Alice lies in her visions to Aro, so they could explain why such ridiculous happened in NM’s Aro vision!

        It all makes so much sense now…

        • TeamJacobEdward

          Wait…. This made me remember something. Alice telling Bella. It was in New Moon. Right before they go save Edward. (yes, I know, I have made a point to commit the books to memory (not really, but I do remember lots)) Anyway. Alice told Bella, that one of the reasons it couldn’t be Alice and had to be Bella was because she said something like “believe it or not, you can lie to yourself/in your thoughts” … “he knows that even if you had died, I’d be thinking ‘she’s alive, she’s alive’ as hard as I can”
          Alice was telling Bella a lot more than she realized.

          • TeamSeth

            SOLVED. This just solved your letter’s mystery.

            Done. We can all go home now.

          • TeamCuhulain

            Exactlyy!!
            Alice can lie as We know Edward knows
            I thought she was
            Immediately. Her
            Masterpiece.
            Art of War.

            But I also feel cheated out of Bella’s
            Shield…so central to her as heroine.

            Hollywood…

        • http://www.talksupe.wordpress.com snowwhitedrifted

          Hmmmmm. She might lie in the visions, but then would Alice have visualized Edward in the khaki pants and Beller in the frolic-y maiden dress? Nope, she’d have stylized them before showing them to Aro.

          • TeamSeth

            Did you see how Alice dressed in NM? I think she DID stylize them…

    • MarbleNutSlut

      I agree. I mean, we don’t care. It’s a movie. A Vampire Movie. That was AWESOME. And really, what do nerds do but dissect our beloved books and movies and bitch, bitch, bitch about plot holes. It’s what we love to do. It’s not just Twilight.

  • OME

    Just a question: Does Jacob live on forever because he’s a werewolf? Since we know that Renesmee will live a long life, possibly an immortal life, will she live that life out with Jacob? Or does she outlive him? While watching BD2 I thought back to a scene where Jacob tries to convince Bella that they could grow old together… so I always thought of Jacob growing old. Maybe that scene was before he turned into a werewolf?? I don’t remember. Any thoughts??

    • TeamSeth

      You’re in luck! It’s in the books! And I remember it sort of! Yay!

      Basically when they are shapeshifting, they are immortal and stay younger/grow slower (like elves in Lord of the Rings). However they can choose to stop shapeshifting. Should they choose that, they resume normal human lifespan and growth. I do believe there are certain limits on their choice though, like they can’t just become a shifter and then decide immediately they want to go back to being human. Those details however, I don’t remember.

      • Sisterpenguin

        Just when I’d put my tweed on to reply…

        • MariaCecilia

          I love it when you wear your tweed…and tweet!

          • Sisterpenguin

            Does get a little smelly though

      • TeamJacobEdward

        Couldn’t have said it better my self. Jacob explains this to Bella when she gets all hissyfit over the no aging thing that he will age again some day when he can keep himself from shifting for a long period of time. So yep. Jacob can live forever so long as he keeps shapeshifing back and forth. Makes the happily ever after even more complete knowing all 4 will live forever.

      • Sari_Chile

        Hi!
        Just want to add that like it as been said, as long as Jabob is shapeshifting he will stay young. And since he will be living with/near vampires forever he will probably shapeshift forever and therefore will be able to stay with Nessie.

        • Teamseth

          I mean, i know this. But I really wanted Nessie to end up with Nahuel. ;)

          • TeamJacobEdward

            Poor Nahuel. Lonely for 150 years.He puts Edward’s loneliness to shame

          • TeamJacobEdward

            (but i’m glad she ha Jacob)

          • Teamseth

            he totes does. I always kind of crushed on nahuel. Then they cast a super hot guy for his part. #win

          • MarbleNutSlut

            Nah. He doesn’t have Edward’s hang ups. Nahuel totes gets his hump on with all the local ladies.

          • JellyBeanRainbow

            And I wanted Leah to end with Jacob, or anyone, someone

    • MarbleNutSlut

      I thought that, too. Nahuel is 150 and still going strong. I know that woofs age slower than normal but…has someone written the fic where Jacob is old like Bella’s grandma and Ness is 17 and adorable forever? And then Old Man Jacob dies? Because none of the old wolves are around. They are not immortal, or even 100+. So the bitch imprints on the girl, then up and dies on her. That’s a pretty shitty deal for any imprintee.

      • TeamSeth

        No way! When Jacob dies then Ness can just move on to Nahuel. He’ll still be smoking hot. Just can’t let him bite you… I see this as an epically awesome deal. The only issue would be that she wouldn’t be used to not getting exactly what she wanted all the effing time.

        Also, can she give birth? One assumes so, since she’s part human. Hm.

        On that topic, but separately, I don’t get why Leah thinks she’s never gonna imprint. She makes some comment in BD, like she can’t get pregnant so she’s not worth imprinting on. But why wouldn’t she be able to get preggers? can only HUMANS get preggers in this universe, but supe males can impregnate at will? Seriously, Leah should be GLAD that she can turn into an effing wolf. Wolves have WAY LESS PAINFUL childbearing than humans. PLUS she’s like super healer and would recover way quickly from it. Am I missing something?

        • The Old One

          I’m thinking it’s because fetuses couldn’t survive the changing back and forth from human to wolf–would they be puppies when born and change into human babies randomly and uncontrollably? The wolf-changing thing happened to kids as adolescents, not younger, and when they got too old it couldn’t happen either, as I remember.
          Remember when we were discussing how many nipples Leah might have?

          • The Old One

            Remember when Peter Facinelli used the set of Nurse Jackie to film a YouTube video of Bella giving birth to puppies?

          • TeamSeth

            No. No, I do not. but I’m glad someone does. Especially since it’s his birthday!

          • The Old One

            Beller’s all, “ooops, my bad!”

          • Sisterpenguin

            LOVE IT!!!

          • http://www.talksupe.wordpress.com snowwhitedrifted

            LOL!
            …and I want that puppy! Even if I have to birth it myself.

  • TeamJacobEdward

    Aw! It’s like LTT Days of Olde with all the commenting and interactions.
    :)
    I’m thankful for you too UC & Moon for bringing me LTT. It was HUGE for me to have, esp in 2010 when I broke down and broke out of my lurkdom and commented for the first time. Team Seth and I were actually just talking about it yesterday. For me, among several others, 2010 would have been a LOT harder if I didn’t have LTT to go to and laugh with and the virtual friends I’ve made through here who understood my inexplicable but irrevocable love of Twi. I owe you UC & Moon. LTT Has brought me all sorts of additional Twi-related things (some rather obscure) that bring a laugh or smile to my face, and not only that, but also a group of people who understand.

    • MarbleNutSlut

      this, exactly.

      I was telling some of my FANCAMP girls (*sniff*) that my Real Life friends asked about my trip, and they did not get it at all. They just patted my head and smiled indulgently, then rolled their eyes at each other AS IF I COULDN’T TELL. They are stupid and you guys are all made of magic. And you will let me yell “they’re not bears!” all the time, and we’ll laugh about Hot Pockets and the Olive Garden and we’ll all think it’s funny. My RL Friends are so stupid I hate them.

      • TeamJacobEdward

        No. They (RL friends) will never understand. They don’t get what it’s like to be Normal.

      • Sisterpenguin

        Fancamp, Spirit Camp and Ashram Esme lives on ’cause every moment has led to this…

        • TeamSeth

          mmmm now I want a bagel

      • TeamSeth

        I LOVE YOU, PETER LAMBERT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    • Sisterpenguin

      Yup yup yup. I’ve had to avoid driving past the alpaca farm if there are other people in the car

  • http://letterstotwilight.com UnintendedChoice

    I love that after everything.. you guys still love Twilight

    • http://letterstotwilight.com UnintendedChoice

      (me too)

      • MarbleNutSlut

        Unconditionally and irrevocably.

    • Sisterpenguin

      Forever…

      • TeamSeth

        …is a long time!

    • TeamJacobEdward

      Unconditionally. No matter how many canyon breaks/holes, second-hand embarrassments, flaws or anything else.

    • JellyBeanRainbow

      Normal fans love Twilight movies and books, but don’t care about every little detail

  • Obladeeobladai

    One theory I’ve heard is since there were so many other “people” there during the “battle,” Alice was able to see the future based on their decisions and then filled in the wolfy holes.

    I just assumed Alice’s vision was like the one she showed Aro in NM — it had basis in reality, but was really just her manipulating her vision for Aro.

    • Sisterpenguin

      Ooooo. I like this

  • MichaelSheenIsADILF

    I’m willing to give it a pass just for Aro’s maniacal laugh at Renesme (he was totally laughing at her dumb name, BTW). Also, another gem from my BF, who endured the movie with me, “wait, he gets to be king of the werewolves AND the vampires??!!?”
    On a twi-serious note, it is pretty problematic that they chose to ignore the Alice vision thing, especially when her inability to see the werewolves was totally pivotal to the plot of New Moon.

    • TeamSeth

      (he was totally laughing at her dumb name, BTW).

      omg i’ve missed you so!!!!

    • TeamJacobEdward

      Not to forget that she couldn’t see the wolves in Eclipse, it even more recently, the fetus inn BD I.

  • TeamSeth

    Um… can we just say it out loud.

    Today is totally a Twilosophy day!!!

    • TeamJacobEdward

      Tweed serious

  • Blondieinco

    I’m probably the worst Twi-fan because it never even occurred to me that Alice shouldn’t have seen the wolves or Ness. I pretty much just wipe my mind clean when going into a Twilight movie and sit back and enjoy – not the time to get all think-y about it all. The surprise was well worth it in my book – and as long as we’re poking holes in the movie, why would Bella’s memories at the end have pictures of herself? She should have just been thinking of all the smexy Edward scenes – no? But that scene was awesome as is. No complaints from my point of view.

    • TeamSeth

      Ha! So right about Beller’s memories!

  • http://www.talksupe.wordpress.com snowwhitedrifted

    I have to see this lil film you speak of.

  • http://twitter.com/carriefaith carriefaith

    Interview with Stephanie & Bill: http://networkedblogs.com/EZ0mx

  • Meghan

    Ask and ye shall receive: http://www.stepheniemeyer.com/

    • Sisterpenguin

      Go the Goddess! It’s almost like she’s been listening.
      And she does sound remarkably normal

    • http://letterstotwilight.com UnintendedChoice

      wow.. what a coincidence this would be posted on the very day LTT is talking about it! the world is full of SO many coincidences!

  • chris

    If she can see the future, why would she think they even needed passports to begin with. Either A) the volturi fight and are defeated according to her vision… no passport needed or b) volturi chooses a different path and don’t fight… no passport needed.

  • reneer29

    I kinda disagree. I don’t think Alice CAN see the wolves alone when they decide something for themselves, but when they’re involved with the whole picture, then I do believe that they’d be in her vision. I think Alice set up the passports and did everything she did to set up the vision she would eventually show Aro. Even if she knew things would turn out ok, she still needed that vision. The only way to GET that vision to show Aro, is if all the others had played out their parts correctly. You can’t show Aro a vision if the preparations hadn’t been done beforehand. Didn’t Alice say she couldn’t see Renesmee in utero? Sounds like the embryonic sac protected Remesmee, but after she was born, Alice could finally see her future. Yup. There’s an explanation for everything…Lol

  • Leah

    That all seems like a reasonable explanation but can’t be right because in breaking dawn the book Alice clearly states that the reason that she couldn’t see the wolves or renessmee in the first place was BECAUSE they were halfbreeds and she couldn’t see their futures cause she never was one hence her saying she can only see the futures of non halfbreeds such as humans and vampires because those two are the only ones she had been so yeah it’s basically a straight up flaw in the story

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